Most pastors don’t stay at a church long enough to really become ‘the pastor’.
I’ve heard that it takes somewhere between 6-8 years in most churches for pastors really to be considered the real ‘pastor’ of a church.
That means 6-8 years before the majority of folk accept you. 6-8 years before many people begin to respect you. 6-8 years before you’re really able to make some of the changes that it takes to move your church forward.
But most pastors don’t make it 6-8 years.
Many have a career of 3-5 year stints… most of which, by their own accounts, have been frustrating and non-successful.
Brian Croft gives an example of why a pastor should really try to tough it out when at all possible.
What do YOU think? What has YOUR experience been?
How long did it take you to really be considered ‘the pastor’?
Todd
Well, let’s face it. All the attention in the “church world” is on explosive church reproductive church movements and such. If you’re in a church that grows really fast in 5 years, according to your numbers above, you aren’t even the “pastor” yet, and yet you’re the keynote speaker at all the conferences.
And yet if you’re in a church 8 years, and have only grown by 5, at least you’re really the pastor now… what would happen if you stayed another 8 years (or a lifetime) instead of moving on to try and be part of a church that is successful according to the metrics of the folks out here in the interwebz. You probably should have been the keynote speaker at that conference, because you’re not just a CEO…
We keep measuring the wrong things.
I think I read that Jim Collins said that your effectiveness window is something like 10-15 years in one place. After that, you start to either fade, get complacent, or stale. Not sure how to reconcile that with the above reflection.
I’m serving my fourth church now. The first church was for 5 years, the second for 7 1/2 years, the third for 13 years and this now I’m beginning my 8th year. The longer periods have been deeper, better, harder and have grown me more for the reasons the author stated. You must face your issues more the longer you stay. But you also find friends who accept you for who you are and now for what you can produce.
I’ve been studying burnout in youth workers for some time now, and this is a big deal topic to me, Todd. Thanks for sharing it.
It’s been my experience that there are some generally significant fruits that come with longevity, but too many of us never get there.
I agree, Todd. Next month I’ll have been at my church for 20 years, so I’ve experienced the benefits of longevity first-hand.
The church I pastor had 5 pastors in the ten years before I came (an average of about 1 1/2 years each, since there were several months without a pastor between each one). As I told them when I came, they hadn’t had a real pastor for a decade, just a series of long-term guest-speakers.
I had to get past that “long-term guest-speaker” syndrome myself, and it took a while. There was a definite shift in tone at about Year 7. I became their pastor in a very real way, and that made ministry a much deeper experience for all of us. And now, at 20 years, I enjoy a credibility factor that I didn’t even have at 15 years.
Ned’s reference to Jim Collins’ concerns about complacency are a real issue, but I think complacency can happen at 5 years as easily as 15. It depends on the pastor. If we keep learning, growing and innovating, and and take the congregation along on the journey, it keeps getting better.
This is my third pastorate, the first was 4 years, second just over 10 and I am into my 4th year now. IN my second year we went through a natural disaster which tore up our building and moved us to re-examine our priorities. I would like to say that things have significantly changed, but they haven’t. What has changed was the trust level. As we walked together through the unknowns and unexpected, we learned to trust each other and trust God in a deeper and more profound way, I think longevity provides for more depth, however a life altering event can either kill a ministry or deepen it significantly, in my case it deepened it. My thoughts anyway!
At least 7 years. We need to look at longer pastorates. People crave stability in an unstable world. However, we need to recommit ourselves every 7 years or we will start serving up “leftovers.” Been here 18 years and the mutual trust is huge.
In the United Methodist Church of which I belong, a long-term pastorate is not the norm. We are annually appointed by our bishop after consultation with a cabinet of district superintendents and the Staff-Parish Relations Committee of the local congregation. I have been under appointment for thirty years. I have served 3.5, 2.5, 7, 8.5 and now going on six years in my current church. This series of appointments was interrupted by a 2-year stint in Cambodia pastoring an international church.
I share all this to affirm that longer pastorates are generally much better. I’ve been tempted to leave my current appointment more than once. I am convinced, however, that I need to press on, which is not what most UM pastors do given how easy it is to move on when ministry gets hard.
A helpful book that a good friend shared with me that looks at this reality from a secular perspective is Seth Godin’s “The Dip: A Little Book That Teaches You When to Quit (and When to Stick). I recommend it for any pastor who is thinking about a change.
Wow. Some great responses. As I have worked with churches, more often their next pastor can be found in their midst. Many times the process for getting the right leadership is flawed and we fail to see who God has placed right there among us. These tend to be the most trusted pastors who may not have to work as hard to “become” the pastor. Some of the best companies to work for promote from within. There is something to be learned from that. When others see a shepherd boy, God may see a king.
Some great comments. Karl Vaters made a comment I want to respond to. “Ned’s reference to Jim Collins’ concerns about complacency are a real issue, but I think complacency can happen at 5 years as easily as 15. It depends on the pastor. If we keep learning, growing and innovating, and and take the congregation along on the journey, it keeps getting better.” Many pastors don’t stay in one place long because they do not grow in their ministry and reach a cap. They then move on to another church where they repeat the same cycle. Here is an article that, although talking about retirement, has a suggestion on how sabbaticals can help pastors stay fresh in ministry and help their churches as well. http://enrichmentjournal.ag.org/200702/200702_066_FinishStrong.cfm
Thanks for the follow-up on my comment, Richard. The cycle you refer to is something I’ve seen many times. Pastors hit that cap, stop growing, then move on. Years ago there was an article entitled “Renewing Without Relocating” (or something like that) which made the point that relocating can become an excuse for not growing. I wish I could remember who wrote it so I could give credit.
I’m convinced that some of the reason pastors move on is because they see limited “growth” potential in their current church (read “numbers”). Since numbers are the only standard for growth they’ve been given, they don’t know what else to do but leave where they are and go to a church where the prospects for numerical growth look more promising.
If we could get the idea that churches can be small and healthy, we might mitigate some of that moving around. Pastors need to know they can stay and thrive, even in a place where the numerical growth is likely to be limited.
Been at my present church eight years last month. Weathered a really stormy first year, but now have a congregation that I consider my family, (Actually better than my own blood family).
I am 67 years old this year, and I plan on being in this pulpit till I go home with Jesus. (I tell my kids that I plan on dying in the pulpit, and my kids here all say, “EEWW, Pastor Tom, don’t say that”).
They know that I turned down a much larger church, with a real salary, (I am Bi-Vocational out of necessity here), and they are thankful for my ministry, and my wife and kids.
If we are talking about huge growth, and a large influx of people as a measure of success, then I am a failure.
However, If we are talking about bringing the hurting to Christ, and bringing the lost, (Both Adults and Youth), to the comfort of God’s Word, and a sense of one’s worth in God’s economy, well then I am a success in the eyes of my people. And that’s enough for me.
In the end, I it is God’s call whether I hear, “Well done, good and faithful servant”!
Todd a question: What happens when you are the fellow following a long ministry and the fellow ( a great guy) who you following is loved and seen as the pastor? I had one ministry of 12 another of 13 and then became the above. Not a good experience. Stayed for 10 years had serious health problems and stepped away to another kind of ministry.
Good question, Chuck. Long-term pastorates may be healthy for the church, but being the new pastor who follows a long-term pastorate is about as tough as ministry gets. We need to do a much better job at pastoral succession.
I have a friend who is an “INTENTIONAL” Interim pastor. His job is to prepare the congregation for the next pastor. He never intends to be their permanent pastor, but to turn over a church to a new pastor in a smooth transition.
Sometimes he is there, for a congregation that is out of control, and the pastor has walked out in frustration.
But, sometimes he is there, to act as a buffer from the perceived need of having their old long time pastor back, and the reality of the need for a new leader, to breathe new life into the congregation.
He has the enviable job of not needing to stay, so, he can step on some toes, and point them back to The Bible, and not to a person.
Pastor Tom, good comment. The interim is a good model for making the transition between a long-term pastor and the next leader. Sometimes we forget that the church is grieving the loss of their pastor much like we grieve at the death of a loved one. It takes time to work through that process. I know one district that uses that same model for smaller churches. There may need to be some issues ironed out before the new pastor comes. Here is an article by David L. Bittinger that talks about the value of the interim pastor. Healthy Pastoral Transitions Equal Healthy Churches for the Future. http://enrichmentjournal.ag.org/200702/200702_090_healthytrans.cfm